HRx Radio- Manager Dialogues Guest: Henry Albrecht, CEO at Limeade Episode: 356 Air Date: March 6, 2020
Henry Albrecht founded Limeade in 2006 and has led the company from new ideas in his vault to a high-growth, industry-leading SaaS employee engagement company that serves some of the smartest companionships in the world.
Before Limeade, Henry served as VP of Product Management at Bocada, an enterprise software company and a make, commerce and business leader at Intuit, where he propelled a number of successful new business initiatives.
Henry made his MBA from Northwestern’s Kellogg School of Management with an emphasis in technology and market and his B.A. in economics and literature from Claremont McKenna College.
Outside of make, Henry enjoys frisking basketball and spending time with his family.
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Full Transcript with timecode
John Sumser:[ 00:00: 00] Good morning and therefore welcomed HR Examiner’s Executive Conversations. Today we’re going to be talking with Henry Albrecht, who’s the CEO of Limeade. Henry, take a moment to introduce yourself would you?
Henry Albrecht:[ 00:00: 25] Hey there everyone. My name is Henry Albrecht and I’m the CEO of Limeade. Limeade is an employee experience technology company focused on things like wellbeing and employee engagement and inclusion and huge communications with your employees based in Bellevue, Washington.
John Sumser:[ 00:00: 41] So Bellevue, Washington does that mean you used to work for Microsoft?
Henry Albrecht:[ 00:00: 44] Oh, I did not. Although we definitely love Microsoft, we’re large-scale devotees and we have certainly hired a fair extent of beings from Microsoft, so it’s a great, it’s a great home to be a tech company up here in the Northwest, snuggled in between Amazon, Microsoft, and about 10 others.
[ 00:01: 02] John Sumser:[ 00:01: 02] What a great thing. So how is it that you’re running an employee experience company that you sprung in a wellness thought? I can’t imagine that in your earliest days, what you thought is that’s what I really was intended to do. And you’ve been building to this moment ever since. So how’d you get now?
Henry Albrecht:[ 00:01: 20] Yeah, well, I like to think of myself as a inquisitive party. [00:01:23] I recall mostly when I started the company, I felt something wrong with direct. Although I am a capitalist, I picture maybe I’m a bit of a jaded capitalist because in some of my early places, I envisioned maybe some of the less humane elements of doing business. A short story is I was working at a company where I was working very long hours with high levels of stress and maybe a little appreciates disconnect with how the business was being run.
[ 00:01: 49] I was get a rash and saying with my family too much and sincerely didn’t recognize the person I witnessed in the reflect. And so I quit and said, I wonder if there’s a way to develop something the above measures all of the statistically valid predictors of adoration your job and loving their own lives, or I guess you would call that employee engagement and wellbeing.
[ 00:02: 10] It was probably not the smartest suggestion, certainly not in the start of a recession, to look at these topics like resilience and optimism and mindfulness and practise and stress and feeling and, you know, affection your job and having determination when people are just trying to cut costs. But, it was really fun, frankly.
[ 00:02: 28] And, it is necessary for a more human approach to work. And although we’ve certainly met our lane through some rotates and changes over time to find our make marketplace shape, I would say we’re still working on the same problem. I symbolize, I guess what I went through is burnout and we have now tools and dashboards to help.
[ 00:02: 46] Big fellowships with 100,000 employees foresee burnout on a global scale. So we’re working on the same problems, probably just with a little more sophistication and a little less crazy naivete.
John Sumser:[ 00:02: 59] So as the CEO of a company like this, what do you do every day?
Henry Albrecht:[ 00:03: 03] Oh gosh, I bid I had an interesting life.
I’d probably wake up and have some cereal with berries and talk to my family and predict the paper and go to work. I generally wake up at 5:30 or 6 and lay in berthed thinking about some sort of work topic. You know, how a feature could be designed to be more social. How, a sales motion can be tightened or something like that.
So I am unfortunately one of those people who accompanieds their work home with them and likes to think about work. But I guess that’s engagement. I still go to all my kid’s athletics games when I’m in city and, and try to be a tolerable pedigree being as well.
John Sumser:[ 00:03: 41] It’s interesting, there’s this kind of archetypical notion out there that work and life are somehow unrelated components that have to be poised by separating them in a large way.
And that doesn’t really seem tolerable or interesting to me. And I imagine that that’s part of what you look at, right? Because, if the person who’s in charge, who’s running the wellness and know companionship is waking up thinking about work, then he must have a different idea about what a good balance is. That claim?
Henry Albrecht:[ 00:04: 13] Yeah. I convey, I believed to be made it on the principal. I “re just saying” I rarely fulfill people who say, I affection my job and I hate my life, or I adoration my life, but I devote 50 hours per week on something I really can’t stand to do. They don’t go hand in hand very well. What we perceived early on in our science investigate is that.
There’s a concept of having signify in your work and there’s the having implication in your life thing. And if you are able to have both of those. In other texts, if you have some sort of overlap between what you really find purposeful and meaningful in your era undertaking that you can bring out to your life or vice versa.
[ 00:04: 51] It’s just a more, I don’t know, the word is synergy. It’s just a better road to live. And I find when I talk to my boys about slog, I don’t end up talking to them about, Hey, what’s the path to the highest monetary success? I foresee maybe parties of my contemporary grew up with the, you are well aware, medical doctors and advocates and CEOs utter the most money so that’s a direction usefulnes pursuing. I try to have gossips more about, you know, what do you have liked to do? What do you want to explore to learn what you love to do? But between now and senility 30 what, what risks do you wanna take so you can find a purpose and you have a job that you love during the day that you, you’re happy to talk about at a cocktail party or at a barbecue with your friends.
[ 00:05: 34] John Sumser: Yeah so Limeade, Limeade from a sort of a positioning perspective, I understood it to be a wellness company and you’ve moved to extend that definition too, to experience. Tell me about the, road of the swivels to get now.
Henry Albrecht:[ 00:05: 52] Yeah. Well, where reference is first started, my co founder, Laura Hamill, and I set out to measure anything that was a statistically valid predictor of wellbeing. And this is when, you know, traditional wellness was various kinds of punishing or Pavlovian and “re just saying”, Hey, do these four or five things and we’ll remuneration you four or 500 bucks. And it never actually constructed any sort of attires or ongoing behavior conversion or kind of meaningful war. It just got beings to prance through hoops. So in looking at all this stuff, this statistical predictors of wellbeing, what we encountered is that a lot of the same predictors were predictors of work commitment. You know, signifying purpose, stretching, learning, having social meaningful relationships and social contacts at work, or a sense of team.
[ 00:06: 43] So when we started with our wellbeing assessment, which was the first of its nature in 2006 and 2007 we had embedded in it a world class employee engagement survey as well. And that’s what Laura Hamill be applicable to do at Microsoft actually. So. I think that DNA has suited us. And then later through our Limeade Institute, we are doing research on other related topics like diversification and inclusion and so, and that helped us kind of lent a module or a mixture related to inclusion and how to communicate with people even how to recognize beings for a place well done.
[ 00:07: 23] All our discipline located ways to show care. And so instead of thinking of it as, Oh, we only sell to the wellness and benefits silo, that is the anchor and core of our business. Preferably we try to take a more science located approaching saying, you know, what does care look like and how does it show up to beings and what does it mean to people?
[ 00:07: 44] So we don’t definitely feel constrained by the silos of how corporate America or the corporate life is set up. Even though sometimes we certainly live in those silos, we don’t want to feel constrained by them. So it’s not really about me. It’s about a bigger concept of upkeep. Do you present care for people through effort?
[ 00:08: 07] John Sumser:[ 00:08: 07] So, I haven’t really was just thinking about this at all, but you’re sort of saying, you’re sharing a couple of things. One thing that you seem to be saying is that wellness is a awfully individual question.
[ 00:08: 21]
[ 00:08: 21] And the second thing that you seem to be saying is that a significant element, although we’ll talk a little bit about whether it’s the,
[ 00:08: 31] exclusively element, the employee experience is an expression of caring from the company. And yes, that’s the neighbourhood that you, that you really work in right?,
[ 00:08: 44] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:08: 44] Yeah, I picture that’s correct. Go on. I’ll let you finish. Sorry.
[ 00:08: 49] John Sumser:[ 00:08: 49] Yeah. Well, I was just going to launch into one of the top three or four things that the software does, but why don’t we just wander away from the script and discover where this vanishes?
[ 00:08: 59] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:08: 59] Yeah. I necessitate, I can give some examples, but what you said is so right on. So in the early days, we would think about, mostly helping people. Do self care, care for yourself, get a good night’s sleep. You know, we had things like ambling challenges, who can get the most steps and let’s connect it to designs and let’s make it social and let’s have commentary.
[ 00:09: 21] How do you distress? Let’s have a meditation or a mindfulness or resilience video that develops parties to monitor their breather and their emotions and attitude. So I would call that. Software based tools to help individuals care for themselves. And it is very personal. You know, you might be a smoker who’s overweight with back sorenes and mettle health issues.
[ 00:09: 44] But you’re ready to work on debriefing and then maybe you’ll be ready to work on walking, et cetera. So you never know what someone’s willing to do are ready to do. And it might be nothing cause they have some childhood issues to deal with. So you’re, you’re absolutely right. It’s a hundred percentage individual.
[ 00:10: 00] But I picture the most interesting insight we’ve had in the last decade is that no matter how great and fun and social and even viral your software is, if you treat it as private individuals, impersonal thing, exclusively. You’ll always be have suboptimal decisions. And we started looking in through the lens that we have of organizational psychology and how great cultures are built in healthcare.
[ 00:10: 25] They would call it like that, a social determinant of health and maybe an employee engagement. They would call it a great culture. So what we decided, or what we found in our study is that it’s actually even more important. How you build a culture around person at work than it is, how huge the software tools for individual improvement are.
[ 00:10: 48] And we developed this research around the science of maintenance. We call it organizational support for wellbeing. So it’s only when you mix the company caring for the person that enables the person to care more for themselves, that you get what I would call a holistic approaching to improving wellbeing.
[ 00:11: 07] The good information is the same general footprint applies to people adoration their jobs. So adoring yourself, cherishing their own lives, cherishing your work. The same footprint of, you know, inviting beings questions, gathering data, spawning targeted recommendations, use maybe Netflix style recommendations. Maybe the thing you thought they might want to do is something different and you are able to learn from them as well.
[ 00:11: 30] So, I don’t know if that answered your question, but I predict a feature that we would deliver that they are able to prove the more administrative line-up of attend. Would be things like a targeted school video for a director on how to talk to their team about these types of topics or how to enable a ruler to show actual human care in a way that’s real.
[ 00:11: 55] That’s not just about earnings per share or perhaps how a social network or an employee resource group. You helps in and kind of nudge them forward in supporting each other. So we’re just trying to use software to show both personal and organizational care.
[ 00:12: 15] John Sumser:[ 00:12: 15] So I picture, remedy me where I’m wrong here. I think that if a wellness is an individual question, it seems like the show of care from an organization, is also kind of an individual thing. How do you think about the difference in what charge symbolizes between organizations?
[ 00:12: 42] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:12: 42] Well, I’m going to both agree and disagree. So that’s when we had to cut the best part. So I will differ. There are a lot of universal constituents. One universal aspect is exactly how I would call the perception of attention. Like I feel that the other person maintenances for me., So there are universal elements of it, but it obviously shows up very different in a, you know, a truck producer than in a hospital than in a high tech company, or, you know, a global airline. And so we serve all of those types of corporations. You know, it really is going to show up differently. One, you might want to tie your curriculum more closely into things that are currently have force there. Like in an airline, it might be a safety focus or a customer service focus.
[ 00:13: 25] In a high tech company, it might be a flexibility and innovation focus. Hey, I want your best idea. So “if youre having” that plan while you’re on a hike or on your bus razz into work, you know, delivering it into work and how can I help you do that? Can I give you greater flexibility? Can I, you are well aware, can I create an environment where you’re willing to plant that grain of invention because there’s trust in the workforce?
[ 00:13: 50] So you’re right that it does vary by workforce, but there are also universal ingredients to it.
[ 00:13: 57] John Sumser:[ 00:13: 57] So the question is really, how do you tell the difference between what works in one company versus what works in another company? And do you have a framework for thinking about that?
[ 00:14: 09] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:14: 09] Well, one direction, probably the simplest way is to ask, you are well aware, having speedy heartbeat canvas of things where right now we’re doing our inclusion in our engagement surveys.
[ 00:14: 21] You know, query parties, Hey, do you feel like you can be recognized and knows we your entirety ego at work at this fellowship and why and why not? Or do you really love your job and would you give your extra inventive idea to this company for your paycheck? Or do you not feel that there’s a square deal that would impel wishes to do that?
[ 00:14: 42] Do you have wellbeing? Are you sleeping well? Are you so stressed out that you can’t, don’t have even a time free to innovate? So those are all what I would call wellbeing commitment, inclusion overlooks, that if you’ve built enough trust, you’ll get a really high response rate. And you’ll know and what you’ll catch out if you know, the majority of members of our corporations find out that we help is that they’ll have green areas and yellow areas and red areas within their company.
[ 00:15: 08] And at least then they can take action, both because we inform the leaders and the managers, but also because these systems should have automated plans of action. If you have a whole department that’s at risk of burnout, there are both things you can do organizationally, like stipulate resources and support to mitigate burnout or maybe additional resources so that it’s better staffed, but there are also things you can do individually to identify it, to recognize it, and maybe to set borderlines around your mental health and physical health.
[ 00:15: 44] But it seemed good to me.
[ 00:15: 47] John Sumser:[ 00:15: 47] Oh , no , no. That was great. That was great. We talked a couple of weeks ago about the fact that you’re focused on inclusion, but not diversification. Help me with that., I take it that,, that has something to do with this central theme of upkeep, but why don’t you facilitate me understand that.
[ 00:16: 06] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:16: 06] Yeah, I’m not sure that’s exactly how I would say it. I would say that inclusion is ethnic. It’s about what acts you’re taking as a culture to help people be their very best. Diversity is about, you are well aware, different articulations and personalities and backgrounds and ethnicities and other things.
[ 00:16: 27] You know, having a voice that’s heard. To me, it’s not about either or inclusion or diversification. It’s, it’s really that if you endow simply in diversification, it’s like investing, you are well aware, in these huge potential. Think of it as like grains of potential immense Redwood oaks but you’re not investing in the grunge for them to grow or the spray, for them to grow. What happens is, you waste a lot of day and money and you create a crappy experience for those people. So to me, if you start with inclusion and what you can do culturally to create a fertile grime, to allow ideas to be sprayed and allow people to bring their whole egoes to work, then when you add in diversity and you can do these things, you know, in a series a month, you don’t have to wait years.
[ 00:17: 15] But then the diversity actually, has the right soil to grow in. And to me it’s, it’s about both. It’s, diversity is kind of necessary but not enough, without a culture of inclusion. And what we’ve also noticed is that companies that are great at wellbeing, it’s easier for them to be great at inclusion or employee participation because they’ve already established the channels of communication, the norms that it’s okay to talk about these issues that some people find, a little too soft for corporate life.
[ 00:17: 48] there’s a ton of cross pollination across these topics and the science reinforces that extremely. There’s a ton of correlation between inclusion, commitment, and wellbeing.
[ 00:18: 00] John Sumser:[ 00:18: 00] Oh, talk about that a little bit. How do you weigh inclusion and how does it correlate with wellness? That’s a very interesting notion.
[ 00:18: 09] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:18: 09] Well, I suppose the first thing is you ask beings if you don’t inclusions is very, it’s just like wellbeing. It’s a very subjective thing. On the outside, you could be an Olympic athlete and precisely have, 7% form fat and be able to run, you are well aware, a mile in four minutes and not is very well. You could be super stressed out, you could have an eating disorder, there could be all kinds of things wrong with you.
[ 00:18: 35] And inclusion is similar on the surface. You could look like you have a high profession and you’re thriving in your career, but, maybe there’s a glass ceiling at your workplace, or perhaps you perceive that, the leaders are just paying lip service to this topic. You is to be able to exclusively get that through qualitative feedback.
[ 00:18: 52] And so obviously having surveys and dashboards that give leaders and boards benchmarks of that are crucial. So to me, you have to ask no, and you have to, you are well aware, you have to have enough trust that you can ask and you think you’ll get the truth, which requires anonymity or privacy commitments as well.
[ 00:19: 12] John Sumser:[ 00:19: 12] All right. That’s interesting. So I’m looking a lot at morals, particularly in AI and predictive sciences right now. What are the ethical issues in your work?
[ 00:19: 24] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:19: 24] Yeah, I think you hit on one privacy, the use of big data if it goes to a personal level, has big ethical implications that, you know, at Limeade we commit not just to the actual privacy for beings, but to the comprehended privacy as well.
[ 00:19: 41] We don’t let managers, instruct down into both individuals and certainly in anything related to health or wellbeing. We follow things like HIPAA and Cobra, GINA and GDPR, EEOC, any acronym you can think of, we have to, and want to live by. To me it’s about not singling people out.
[ 00:20: 00] You “re going to have to” make that more administrative panorama. I want to know what agencies in my companionship have the least sense of inclusion or the highest sense of wellbeing. So to me, privacy is absolutely a huge ethical issue. And the second largest one I would say is, I guess you could call it like, do you want to work with dorks?
[ 00:20: 24] You know Limeade has a no yanks policy. We have a kind of a ethic of empathy. And if you miss, I can share why we do that, but if you don’t want, that’s okay extremely.
[ 00:20: 38] John Sumser:[ 00:20: 38] Well, so let’s get to that, but what I want to ask you is, you elevate the interesting notion that some parts of the employee experience are private. And I consider, that’s probably a startle . . In fact, this is the first time that I’ve ever heard the notion that some parts of employee experience are private. And so how do you finagle that? Because much of what matters in employee knowledge is very public.
[ 00:21: 10] Because it’s about me and my job in the company right? And so that, is not a private thing at all. And, hitherto there’s this seat that you’re accurately recognizing where, some aspects of what you can measure about me are mine and not yours. And some of my opinion on how the world operates and how I feel about that are mine to disclose at the time of my choose rather than yours to removed from me in the time of your prefer. Right. And so,
[ 00:21: 43] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:21: 43] Yeah, I agree with that.
[ 00:21: 45] John Sumser:[ 00:21: 45] The match between Internal and external material. How do you figure that out? Because it’s gotta vary by culture.
[ 00:21: 53] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:21: 53] Well,, it goes my culture, yes. And we’re a world business. We have powers in Canada and Germany in the U S and we provide people in a hundred different companionships. So. You know, being world-wide isn’t just about data centers and law compliance, it’s about cultural norms. And I think there’s a debate going on in the world. It’s being legislated about who does control information, who holds my data.
[ 00:22: 18] And Limeaid has always been a science based group. We try to, refer to the best science-based practises. And sincerely, I don’t know if there are as many of, on this subject as there could be. And that’s an area of research for our Limeade Institute is, you are well aware, what are the global perceptions of what can be private and not.
[ 00:22: 38] So we’re elicited to be part of that legislation, that debate, but we are also going to err on the side of trust. You know, specific employees relying their employers, and trusting their employees. So that planneds probably a little bit more privacy. And when you are opting in, let’s say to social narration in the software application, it’s very obvious and explicit.
[ 00:23: 04] You’re opting in because it’s a social feed and you’ve been alerted that there is certain things you can participate in on. So. I visualize it’s an exciting debate. I would say something like your state aid or how many, how well you’re sleeping according to your Fitbit device. Those are things that you know, you wouldn’t miss your administrator to know.
[ 00:23: 25] On the flip side, we want managers to be able to ask supervisors, hires, how are you? And we want employees to be able to speak clearly and say, you know what? I’m not immense. I could be better. So it is an interesting debate.
[ 00:23: 40] John Sumser:[ 00:23: 40] Yeah, well, and so I’m going to argue with you that there’s a generic standard of any kind, because, you are well aware, as you’ve been talking, I’ve been thinking about astronauts and Seal units and in that work environment personal data about physical wellness can’t open to be private. It’s most monitored, it’s most shared, reason what you want is a team performing at the ultimate peak of its optimal physical functionality, right? And that’s a requirement of the job. Right? And I imagine there’s a spectrum from that extreme to it doesn’t matter whether I am totally unwell, because the job happens in the gap where that’s an irrelevant.
[ 00:24: 30] And so you’ve got the spectrum and across that spectrum it’s going to be errand and culture specific. What, where the boundary is between personal and public in the data and that would be a fascinating thing to see how you fought with, what do you think?
[ 00:24: 47] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:24: 47] Yeah, I mean, well, first of all, I have a friend who’s a former Navy seal. I don’t think that has become a Navy seal is a good proxy for success in the modern business macrocosm in most cases. It’s not the most,
[ 00:25: 01] John Sumser:[ 00:25: 01] Yeah, we’re not talking about generic success. We’re talking about its own experience of an employee in a company. And it is therefore diversifies, right? There isn’t a generic account of just, that’s part of your contents is that success is an individual thing, wellness is an individual thing. And so this where’s the standard and am I comfy with the standard question? That’s an interesting one.
[ 00:25: 29] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:25: 29] I find that it’s actually, you can provide through application, a highly individual recommendation, an action plan, a placed of things that someone could do, just like Netflix can provide, a located of action movies they think you will like and you are able to like them and you might not, but you can do that through software without the employer ever knowing what’s being recommended to John or Henry or Molly or anybody else. So to me, the strength of application is, you can have a mass personalization without ever ratting anybody out for their issues. You know, maybe someone boozes too much and they actually want to work on it and they don’t want to get fired for it. And so I believed to be you can do that. That is possible that the modern wellbeing approaches can do that in. So that’s the individual argument. I would say from a more general population wise, there is value in confidence versus disbelief. And I think if we go into all of these discussions saying, we can never talk about anything related to stress or wellbeing or, rely with our overseers at work, with the people we work with. We’re sub-optimizing for ourselves and for our handiwork. You know, we’re human beings.
[ 00:26: 48] We need human relationships. We just have to be able to trust our organizations. And I think that’s where companies could use a little work. Honestly, I don’t think generation Z and millennial and even the benefit of future generations beyond them come through here are, are really going to put up with the same, kind of didactic work environments that maybe I put up with when I was in my twenties.
[ 00:27: 13] John Sumser:[ 00:27: 13] Interesting stuff! We could go around and around about a got a couple of these things. But we’re at the end of our time together, so thanks for taking the time to do this. You was intended to encapsulate Limeade one more time so parties understand the core thing that we’re talking about here. Limeade is a company that, X.
[ 00:27: 33] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:27: 33] That every employee will know, you care about them when you use it. We do work wellbeing, participation, inclusion with huge communication, and I think it’s important, John, really to wrap up with, okay, so this care thing, that’s great, but like I’m a CEO of a big business. I’m paid in respect of earnings per share on market share on growth. What we’ve encountered though is that when, when hires actually perceive attention, they’re nine times more likely to stay at their firm for three or more years.
[ 00:28: 03] They’re four times less likely to suffer from stress and burnout. There are hard number ROI associated with something that maybe beings my senility and older and grew up thinking were wimpy and soft. Frankly, they’re not. They’re human needs. And I think it’s our job to meet those needs. So I revalue you, spending the time with me today. It’s awesome.
[ 00:28: 25] John Sumser:[ 00:28: 25] Thanks. So reintroduce yourself and tell people how to get hold of you.
[ 00:28: 29] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:28: 29] Yeah. Again, I’m Henry Albrecht, CEO of Limeade. You can reach me at Henry at Limeade dot com. You can check out our website and we have tons of resources and downloadable, science-backed clauses about these topics.
[ 00:28: 43] John Sumser:[ 00:28: 43] So, thanks for taking the time to do this Henry.
[ 00:28: 45] It’s been a treat of a conference and there are a lot of Sparky questions here that we ought to talk about again.
[ 00:28: 51] Henry Albrecht:[ 00:28: 51] All right. I hope to talk to you again too John.
[ 00:28: 53] John Sumser:[ 00:28: 53] Thanks Henry.
[ 00:28: 55] You’ve been listening to HR Examiner’s Executive Conversations and we’ve been talking with Henry Albrecht, he is the CEO of Limeade.
[ 00:29: 02] Thanks very much for singing in and we’ll see you back here next week.
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